It’s a mystery
Posted by John Autin on June 23, 2011
[The mystery has been solved -- see Bubba @35.]
What do these players have in common? For the 2 groups listed below:
- Each member of a group has something in common with every other member of that group.
- The common factor of Group 1 is the opposite of that of Group 2.
- The common factors are something in their performance record.
- The order in which players are listed is merely alphabetical.
I will update the post to list pertinent facts as they are uncovered.
Facts uncovered so far:
- They have all played this year.
- No player in Group 1 has been an All-Star.
- Every player in Group 2 has been an All-Star; all but Ortiz have made it exactly once.
- Each group is composed of a player at every position, including DH and relief pitcher.
Group 1
Group 2
Chris Young (the outfielder)
Go to it!
June 23rd, 2011 at 10:49 pm
For starters, they are all active and have played this season.
June 23rd, 2011 at 10:59 pm
@1, KB -- That is true. I have updated the post to show that they have all played this season. I will add pertinent facts to the post as they are uncovered.
June 23rd, 2011 at 11:08 pm
Group 1 - Never an All-Star.
Group 2 - Have been an All-Star
June 23rd, 2011 at 11:12 pm
Aw man. I was going for "Group 1 has played for more than one organization, if you count Mark Ellis in the minor leagues." Yeah, a bit of stretch.
June 23rd, 2011 at 11:13 pm
@3, Spindlebrook -- That is true, but it is not the complete answer.
June 23rd, 2011 at 11:19 pm
Everyone in group B has made exactly 1 All-Star team?
June 23rd, 2011 at 11:19 pm
1: Best 2011 WAR for never having been an all-star
2: Worst 2011 WAR for former all-stars
June 23rd, 2011 at 11:20 pm
@7, Oneblankspace -- That is not a true statement.
June 23rd, 2011 at 11:22 pm
@6, Tom -- That, surprisingly, is true. Hard to believe Phillips didn't make the All-Star team in his 30-30 year.
June 23rd, 2011 at 11:24 pm
I forgot to add that Tom's statement @6, while true, is not directly part of the answer.
June 23rd, 2011 at 11:37 pm
Probably doesn't help any, but I know it has nothing to do with the playoffs since DeJesus has never been in a playoff game. Although the first thing that jumped at me was how many guys in Group A played in the 2007 ALCS. Hafner, Peralta, and Choo for the Indians and Crisp for the Sox (2 years after being traded there by the Indians). Ok, so 4/11 isn't that many, but whatever, it's been a long day
June 23rd, 2011 at 11:41 pm
@11, Djibouti -- Don't sweat it. But no, the postseason is not relevant to this mystery.
June 23rd, 2011 at 11:54 pm
MEA MAXIMA CULPA! --
Through an editing error (translation: "I screwed up!"), the original Group 2 was missing 2 players: Cesar Izturis and David Ortiz. I have updated the post.
Both groups now contain exactly 11 players, unless I'm even more brain-dead than I was before....
June 23rd, 2011 at 11:56 pm
You can all kill me now.
The restoration of Ortiz to his proper place in Group 2 means that it is NOT TRUE that every player in Group 2 made the All-Star team exactly once. Ortiz is the lone exception.
June 23rd, 2011 at 11:58 pm
My deepest apologies for these errors, which may have thrown you off the track. I have updated the post.
June 24th, 2011 at 12:01 am
So, now that each group has 11 players ... why 11 players?
June 24th, 2011 at 12:20 am
Each group has a player for each field position, a starting pitcher, a relief pitcher, and a DH.
June 24th, 2011 at 12:21 am
A top 10 list with a 2-way tie for 10th?
June 24th, 2011 at 12:25 am
Doug @17 is right about the reason for 11 players -- one at each position, including a DH and a relief pitcher.
June 24th, 2011 at 12:29 am
So, why did I choose these particular 11 All-Stars?
Why Cesar Izturis, and not, say, Elvis Andrus or Felipe Lopez?
Why Brandon Phillips instead of Jose Lopez?
Why Dioner Navarro over John Buck?
June 24th, 2011 at 12:45 am
Folks, I hate to say it, but my bedtime is nigh. If you want to know the answer, say so in a comment, and I'll e-mail you directly.
June 24th, 2011 at 1:04 am
Since I'm about to sign off, I'll send an e-mail to everyone who's posted so far. Dons't read it if you want to keep working the mystery. I'll check in tomorrow.
June 24th, 2011 at 1:34 am
These are all people who have never been in my kitchen.
June 24th, 2011 at 3:41 am
Pretty much all of the guys in group two have had bad or mediocre years this year for what you would expect for an all-star in the previous year. All of the guys in group 1 have improved signifantly from last year. Is it all stars last year who have lost the most WAR, and non-all-stars from last year who have gained the most WAR?
June 24th, 2011 at 3:45 am
Nevermind, Shin-soo-Choo regressed this year. Does group 1 include the highes WARs in a paticular year to not make an all-star team, and group 2 lowest WAR last year to make an all-star team at their positions?
June 24th, 2011 at 4:50 am
@23: LMAO
June 24th, 2011 at 8:38 am
No, Mr Clavin, you forgot that time when you, Norm, and Paul kidnapped Mr Ortiz and took him to your kitchen to meet your mother.
June 24th, 2011 at 8:52 am
The 3 current Oakland A's (and former A Eric Chavez) are throwing me off. There has to be some correlation between those 3 (or 4). Any hints?
June 24th, 2011 at 10:11 am
Here's a hint, of sorts:
I was surprised to find that, e.g., Eric Chavez and Travis Hafner had never been All-Stars, and that Cesar Izturis had been one.
And I'm aghast at Ty Wigginton's consistently awful defensive rating.
June 24th, 2011 at 10:17 am
@28, Randy -- Interesting angle. In a broad sense, it could be said that there is a loose correlation between what Group 1 has in common, and the fact that 3 of them are currently on the A's, whereas (in a weaker correlation) none of Group 2 are A's. That connection was not any part of my thinking when I did the searches that produced these groups, but I can see it after the fact.
June 24th, 2011 at 10:42 am
Thought I was on to something, but Dotel started his career in the NL
June 24th, 2011 at 10:47 am
My thought was that group #1 wasn't an all star, despite being better than the guy from their team that was an all-star... and that group #2 were all stars, despite being not as good as someone on their team who wasn't an all-star.
Jason Heyward blows that out, though, since the only guy with a higher WAR on Atlanta in 2010 (Tim Hudson) made the all star team.
June 24th, 2011 at 11:07 am
It's not about any one year, except in the very narrow sense that each guy in Group 2 made the All-Star team in a given year.
June 24th, 2011 at 11:11 am
It might help to think about Group 2 minus Heyward and Ortiz. Although they technically meet the criteria that I searched on, they don't really fit the concept that the criteria were meant to capture -- Ortiz in particular; but I decided that my "teams" would have a DH, so Ortiz came in by default.
June 24th, 2011 at 11:19 am
Group 1=highest active WAR for a player @ each position who has never made the AS team.
Group 2=lowest active WAR for a player @ each position who HAS made an AS team.
I'd guess Ortiz is there b/c noone else has made it as a DH.
June 24th, 2011 at 11:26 am
WE HAVE A WINNER!!!!!
Congratulations to Bubba @35.
And yes, David Ortiz is the only active "career DH" (min. 50% of games played at DH) who has been an All-Star.
Thanks to all you deep thinkers out there ... and to you, too, Cliff Clavin! 🙂
June 24th, 2011 at 11:31 am
Bubba, you advance to the Final Mystery round:
What do these first names represent?
-- Charles
-- Emory
-- Richard
-- Leslie
-- Charles
-- Wycliffe
-- John
-- Thomas
June 24th, 2011 at 11:42 am
Nice:)
They are all my brothers from another mother.
All the Bubba's in major league history.
June 24th, 2011 at 11:49 am
Yeah, I knew Wycliffe would give it away....
Congrats again!
http://www.gardneredge.com/sports/2010/11/19/3508-bubba-starling-ranks-first-in-baseball-america-s-top-100
June 24th, 2011 at 12:57 pm
Derek
June 24th, 2011 at 3:20 pm
Be that as it may, John, those people have never been in my kitchen.
June 24th, 2011 at 3:37 pm
@41, "Cliff" -- I was taking a poke at the original (fictional) "Cliff Clavin" -- not at you.
June 24th, 2011 at 4:22 pm
How nuts is it the Choo has never been an allstar?
June 24th, 2011 at 7:09 pm
@43 Carl: How nuts is it that the same guy finished in the top 10 in WAR years in a row and made less than $500,000 per year each year? And that Young made over five times as much over the same two years? Talk about under rated and underpaid.
June 24th, 2011 at 11:29 pm
So close with my post #7. The negative-0.1 for Navarro is what led my thinking that way.
June 25th, 2011 at 3:14 am
Nice trivia question JA!
June 26th, 2011 at 3:16 am
Andy -- High praise, coming from the maestro!