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Verlander ties 21st-century high in postseason pitches

Posted by John Autin on October 13, 2011

Justin Verlander threw 133 pitches over 7.1 innings of ALCS game 5, allowing 4 runs (and the obligatory Nelson Cruz HR), but he bridged Detroit's bullpen gap and handed the ball to temporary closer, Phil Coke, who insured that their season would have at least one more road trip.

Verlander, who threw more pitches than anyone during the regular season, surpassed by 1 his previous career high (set this May 29), and matched the postseason high of this century, set by Mark Prior in game 3 of the 2003 NLDS.

[Tigers fans pause for somber reflection on Prior's career. Only 23 years old that day, he would win just 19 more games.]

Enough angst, Bengal backers! So Prior flamed out. But check out the list below; a lot of guys threw 133 or more pitches in a postseason game and went right on with their careers. Roger Clemens had three higher pitch counts in the '86 postseason alone -- including a sequence of 142 pitches, 3 days' rest, and 134 pitches -- and all he did over the next 6 seasons was average 19 wins, 258 IP and 239 Ks. Fourteen years later, a 38-year-old Rocket threw 138 pitches in a 1-hit shutout in game 4 of the 2000 ALCS.

Here are the highest postseason pitch counts that are searchable on B-R. (Pitch counts are available for all games since 1988, and for some games as far back as 1970.)

Rk Player Date Series Gm# Tm Opp Rslt App,Dec IP H R ER BB SO HR Pit Str GSc IR IS BF AB 2B 3B IBB HBP SH SF GDP SB CS PO BK WP ERA WPA RE24 aLI
1 Steve Carlton 1980-10-15 WS 2 PHI KCR W 6-4 GS-8 ,W 8.0 10 4 3 6 10 0 159 92 52 38 30 1 0 0 0 1 1 3 2 0 0 0 1 3.38 -0.245 -0.242 1.558
2 Luis Tiant 1975-10-15 WS 4 BOS CIN W 5-4 CG 9 ,W 9.0 9 4 4 4 4 0 155 87 53 39 34 3 1 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4.00 0.337 0.207 1.810
3 Britt Burns 1983-10-08 ALCS 4 CHW BAL L 0-3 GS-10 ,L 9.1 6 1 1 5 8 1 150 88 75 38 31 0 0 0 1 1 0 2 0 0 0 0 0 0.96 0.386 3.947 1.653
4 David Cone 1995-10-08 ALDS 5 NYY SEA L 5-6 GS-8 7.2 9 4 4 3 9 2 147 86 51 35 32 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 4.70 -0.220 -0.226 1.563
5 Curt Schilling 1993-10-21 WS 5 PHI TOR W 2-0 SHO9 ,W 9.0 5 0 0 3 6 0 147 99 80 33 30 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 0 1 0 0 0 0.00 0.550 4.469 1.299
6 Fernando Valenzuela 1981-10-23 WS 3 LAD NYY W 5-4 CG 9 ,W 9.0 9 4 4 7 6 2 147 92 52 40 32 2 0 2 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 0 0 4.00 0.197 -0.232 1.471
7 Livan Hernandez 1997-10-12 NLCS 5 FLA ATL W 2-1 CG 9 ,W 9.0 3 1 1 2 15 1 143 88 90 31 29 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 1.00 0.609 3.389 1.243
8 Al Leiter 2000-10-26 WS 5 NYM NYY L 2-4 GS-9 ,L 8.2 7 4 3 3 9 2 142 84 62 36 33 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 3.12 -0.103 0.463 1.313
9 Livan Hernandez 1997-10-23 WS 5 FLA CLE W 8-7 GS-9 ,W 8.0 7 6 5 8 2 1 142 77 40 38 29 0 1 0 0 1 0 2 0 0 0 0 1 5.62 -0.036 -0.777 1.173
10 Roger Clemens 1986-10-07 ALCS 1 BOS CAL L 1-8 GS-8 ,L 7.1 10 8 7 3 5 0 142 93 30 36 33 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 8.59 -0.272 -2.756 .533
11 Tim Wakefield 1992-10-13 NLCS 6 PIT ATL W 13-4 CG 9 ,W 9.0 9 4 4 4 4 2 141 92 53 41 37 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 4.00 0.064 0.147 .211
12 Kevin Brown 1997-10-14 NLCS 6 FLA ATL W 7-4 CG 9 ,W 9.0 11 4 4 1 8 0 140 89 56 39 37 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 4.00 0.169 0.712 .882
13 Mike Boddicker 1983-10-06 ALCS 2 BAL CHW W 4-0 SHO9 ,W 9.0 5 0 0 3 14 0 140 92 88 36 31 0 0 0 2 0 0 0 2 1 0 0 0 0.00 0.405 4.430 .923
14 Dave Stewart 1992-10-12 ALCS 5 OAK TOR W 6-2 CG 9 ,W 9.0 7 2 2 3 5 1 139 94 67 35 32 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 2.00 0.217 2.077 .687
15 Roger Clemens 2000-10-14 ALCS 4 NYY SEA W 5-0 SHO9 ,W 9.0 1 0 0 2 15 0 138 87 98 30 28 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0.00 0.438 5.113 .755
16 Dave Stewart 1989-10-14 WS 1 OAK SFG W 5-0 SHO9 ,W 9.0 5 0 0 1 6 0 138 86 82 34 33 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0.00 0.240 4.207 .486
17 Randy Johnson 1997-10-05 ALDS 4 SEA BAL L 1-3 CG 8 ,L 8.0 7 3 3 2 13 2 137 90 67 33 31 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 3.38 0.005 1.305 .628
18 Mike Boddicker 1990-10-09 ALCS 3 BOS OAK L 1-4 CG 8 ,L 8.0 6 4 2 3 7 0 137 80 62 35 28 0 0 1 2 1 1 1 3 2 0 0 0 2.25 -0.170 -0.286 .974
19 Moose Haas 1982-10-09 ALCS 4 MIL CAL W 9-5 GS-8 ,W 7.1 5 5 4 5 7 1 137 80 52 32 27 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 4.91 0.119 -1.489 .495
20 Mike Flanagan 1979-10-10 WS 1 BAL PIT W 5-4 CG 9 ,W 9.0 11 4 2 1 7 1 137 100 59 41 40 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 1 0 0 2.00 0.294 0.581 1.485
21 Jim Beattie 1978-10-15 WS 5 NYY LAD W 12-2 CG 9 ,W 9.0 9 2 2 4 8 0 137 85 65 38 34 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 2 1 0 0 0 2.00 0.016 2.107 .672
22 Don Sutton 1974-10-13 WS 2 LAD OAK W 3-2 GS-8 ,W 8.0 5 2 2 2 9 0 137 88 71 31 28 2 0 0 1 0 0 2 0 0 0 0 1 2.25 0.293 2.071 1.064
23 Jeff Fassero 1997-10-04 ALDS 3 SEA BAL W 4-2 GS-9 ,W 8.0 3 1 1 4 3 0 136 82 71 30 25 1 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 1 1 0 0 1.12 0.535 3.912 1.193
24 Doug Drabek 1991-10-16 NLCS 6 PIT ATL L 0-1 CG 9 ,L 9.0 7 1 1 3 5 0 136 82 71 36 32 3 0 1 0 1 0 0 2 1 0 0 0 1.00 0.210 3.077 1.589
25 Kirk McCaskill 1986-10-08 ALCS 2 CAL BOS L 2-9 GS-7 ,L 7.0 10 6 3 3 6 0 136 92 42 35 32 2 1 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 3.86 -0.241 -2.343 1.055
Rk Player Date Series Gm# Tm Opp Rslt App,Dec IP H R ER BB SO HR Pit Str GSc IR IS BF AB 2B 3B IBB HBP SH SF GDP SB CS PO BK WP ERA WPA RE24 aLI
26 Charlie Leibrandt 1985-10-20 WS 2 KCR STL L 2-4 GS-9 ,L 8.2 6 4 4 2 6 0 136 85 60 34 32 3 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4.15 -0.354 0.274 1.515
27 Fernando Valenzuela 1983-10-05 NLCS 2 LAD PHI W 4-1 GS-8 ,W 8.0 7 1 1 4 5 1 136 79 65 33 28 1 0 0 0 1 0 3 1 0 0 0 1 1.12 0.241 1.655 1.111
28 Steve Rogers 1981-10-16 NLCS 3 MON LAD W 4-1 CG 9 ,W 9.0 7 1 1 1 5 0 136 86 73 34 33 0 0 0 0 0 0 3 1 0 0 0 1 1.00 0.253 2.927 .981
29 Jim Palmer 1970-10-05 ALCS 3 BAL MIN W 6-1 CG 9 ,W 9.0 7 1 1 3 12 0 136 89 78 36 33 0 1 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 1.00 0.236 3.217 .611
30 David Wells 1998-09-29 ALDS 1 NYY TEX W 2-0 GS-8 ,W 8.0 5 0 0 1 9 0 135 92 80 30 29 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0.00 0.505 4.394 1.091
31 John Smoltz 1996-10-24 WS 5 ATL NYY L 0-1 GS-8 ,L 8.0 4 1 0 3 10 0 135 79 79 31 28 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0.00 0.334 3.439 1.135
32 David Cone 1995-10-03 ALDS 1 NYY SEA W 9-6 GS-8 ,W 8.0 6 4 4 6 5 2 135 77 53 36 30 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4.50 -0.057 0.510 1.530
33 Curt Schilling 1993-10-06 NLCS 1 PHI ATL W 4-3 GS-8 8.0 7 2 2 2 10 0 135 88 68 33 30 2 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 2.25 0.320 1.973 1.447
34 Jack Morris 1984-10-09 WS 1 DET SDP W 3-2 CG 9 ,W 9.0 8 2 2 3 9 0 135 86 69 35 32 2 0 0 0 0 0 1 1 1 0 0 0 2.00 0.529 2.077 1.489
35 Matt Keough 1981-10-15 ALCS 3 OAK NYY L 0-4 GS-9 ,L 8.1 7 2 1 6 4 1 135 71 61 39 32 0 0 0 0 1 0 1 0 0 0 0 1 1.08 0.201 2.051 1.096
36 Catfish Hunter 1976-10-17 WS 2 NYY CIN L 3-4 CG 9 ,L 8.2 10 4 3 4 5 0 135 79 51 40 35 2 1 1 0 0 1 0 2 1 0 0 0 3.12 -0.299 -0.343 1.103
37 Orlando Hernandez 2000-10-24 WS 3 NYY NYM L 2-4 GS-8 ,L 7.1 9 4 4 3 12 1 134 91 53 34 30 4 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4.91 -0.106 0.082 1.470
38 Steve Avery 1993-10-11 NLCS 5 ATL PHI L 3-4 GS-7 7.0 4 2 1 2 5 0 134 80 66 28 24 1 0 0 0 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 1.29 0.087 1.555 .771
39 Tim Belcher 1988-10-05 NLCS 2 LAD NYM W 6-3 GS-9 ,W 8.1 5 3 3 3 10 1 134 90 68 30 27 2 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 1 0 0 0 3.24 0.142 0.332 .616
40 Roger Clemens 1986-10-25 WS 6 BOS NYM L 5-6 GS-7 7.0 4 2 1 2 8 0 134 89 69 26 24 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 2 0 0 0 0 1.29 0.153 1.179 1.309
41 Roger Clemens 1986-10-11 ALCS 4 BOS CAL L 3-4 GS-9 8.1 8 3 3 3 9 1 134 92 61 35 32 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 1 0 0 0 3.24 0.374 2.677 1.229
42 Ron Guidry 1978-10-13 WS 3 NYY LAD W 5-1 CG 9 ,W 9.0 8 1 1 7 4 0 134 79 64 39 32 1 0 0 0 0 0 2 1 1 0 0 0 1.00 0.375 3.107 1.392
43 Don Gullett 1977-10-11 WS 1 NYY LAD W 4-3 GS-9 8.1 5 3 3 6 6 0 134 74 61 35 27 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 0 1 0 0 0 3.24 0.176 1.597 1.253
44 Mark Prior 2003-10-03 NLDS 3 CHC ATL W 3-1 CG 9 ,W 9.0 2 1 1 4 7 0 133 89 82 34 28 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 0 0 0 1 1.00 0.493 3.712 1.059
45 Woody Williams 2001-10-10 NLDS 2 STL ARI W 4-1 GS-8 ,W 7.0 4 1 1 1 9 0 133 88 73 26 25 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1.29 0.348 3.578 .842
46 David Cone 1996-10-10 ALCS 2 NYY BAL L 3-5 GS-6 6.0 5 2 2 5 5 1 133 77 54 28 23 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 3.00 0.191 1.646 1.277
47 Dwight Gooden 1988-10-09 NLCS 4 NYM LAD L 4-5 GS-9 8.1 5 4 4 5 9 1 133 84 61 35 30 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 4 0 0 1 2 4.32 -0.270 -0.766 1.185
Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Play Index Tool Used
Generated 10/13/2011.

 

Related posts:

    Torii Hunter ties his career high with 7 RBI
    Long Postseason Games
    Hitting 4 HRs but losing a postseason finale
    Worst Postseason Game Score
    Bases-empty intentional walks in the postseason

This entry was posted on Thursday, October 13th, 2011 at 10:47 pm and is filed under Uncategorized. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. Both comments and pings are currently closed.

69 Responses to “Verlander ties 21st-century high in postseason pitches”

  1. Zachary Says:
    October 13th, 2011 at 11:04 pm

    134 pitches or not, I still say Rogah asked out of the game, the pansy.

  2. Voomo Zanzibar Says:
    October 13th, 2011 at 11:35 pm

    Back to back outings from Cone as well, one in which he managed to throw 133 in six innings.

  3. Johnny Twisto Says:
    October 13th, 2011 at 11:52 pm

    Verlander, who threw more pitches

    Your link to "more pitches" isn't quite working -- the novice B-R user won't get the information you're trying to present.

    ***

    I had no idea Clemens threw 138 pitches in that start vs Seattle in '00. I remember that game well; he was untouchable. Pitch counts were news by that point, and I'm surprised I don't remember any discussion at the time about how many pitches he had thrown. But I see Clemens had already topped 125 pitches 12 times in his first two Yankee seasons ('99-'00), despite not pitching *that* well in those seasons. Surprising, since earlier in 2000 Clemens had started a regular season Yankee record of 104 consecutive starts without a CG (this lasted into '03). The pitch count revolution had started, yet it still seems very different from today.

    ***

    Verlander completed the season with 52 straight starts of at least 100 pitches, easily the most since 1988. It may well be the longest streak going back many years before that, but we may never know that for sure. Two of his first three postseason starts this season were under 100 pitches (the first not his fault, but hey, that's how it goes).

    ***

    Pitch counts are available for all games since 1988, and for some games as far back as 1970.

    For some games they go back to the '50s, when Allen Roth was charting them for the Dodgers. Also, I don't think we have them for every game since '88, but certainly the vast majority.

  4. Dukeofflatbush Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:03 am

    Since 2007, Verlander has 16 regular season games of 125 pitches or more.
    The next closest pitcher(s) are Lincecum and Halladay at 7, less than half of Verlander, and both of them have faced NL teams, which I imagine allows the pitcher to have at least two or three at bats where he doesn’t exert the same effort as dealing with the 9 hitter in the AL.
    Edwin Jackson has the single game high, in - I believe the whole 2000’s, with his 149 pitch, 8BB no hitter.

  5. Timothy P. Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:06 am

    How about Delmon Young, the guy is great and Detroit has played great ball since about the time Delmon came over from the Twins. Delmon gets beat up a lot here I guess because he was the first pick and all, but he's shown when healthy, he can hit. Tonight he hit while not being healthy!

  6. Dukeofflatbush Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:11 am

    Wow! from 2009-2011, Verlander has 32 individual games of 120 pitches or more. Next closest is Lincecum with 13.
    And from 2007-2011, Verlander has the most 100pitch games at 142, or 85% of his starts.

  7. Johnny Twisto Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:15 am

    Why would he get beat up for being the first pick?

    I beat him up because he's a complete bum. This postseason is adding a year to his career. Estimated date of completion: 2016.

  8. John Autin Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:15 am

    @3, JT - Thanks for the note on the pitches link, which I've now tightened up -- it should go directly to a sorted list.

  9. Johnny Twisto Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:16 am

    Looks splendid, JA.

  10. Dukeofflatbush Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:17 am

    Timmy P.

    During Detroit’s celebration after vanquishing the Yankees, I noticed for the first time, that while in a champagne soaked t-shirt D-Young had the most barrel-esque chest I’ve seen in MLB since the BIG Z announced his BIG R.
    Do you agree with this assessment and would you care to contrast and compare how these barrel chests play a roll in each player’s strength and weakness’s. Or, can you look inward and honestly search your subconscious for any trace the barrel chest may play in your devotion to these two heros of the game and your heart.

  11. John Autin Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:20 am

    @7 -- Hey, now! Delmon may be a replacement-level player ... but he's our replacement-level player!

    Besides, it's all relative -- as a replacement for Magglio (-1.9 WAR this year) Ordonez, even a no-throw Delmon looks like a player.

  12. John Autin Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:25 am

    @10 -- Pitching tip for C.J.: Keep the ball away from the barrel!

    http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play.jsp?content_id=19895907

  13. John Autin Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:28 am

    How about Avila's "gimpy Gibby" HR trot?
    http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play.jsp?content_id=19893769

  14. Timothy P. Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:30 am

    Delmon is not a bum, as recently as last year he drove in 112 runs and he's only 25 years old. Lots of upside for Delmon. In games Delmon played after coming to the Tigers, they went 30-10, not bad. I guess that doesn't help in fantasy leagues so it doesn't matter.

  15. Johnny Twisto Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:34 am

    We get it JA, you've figured out how to direct-link MLB videos. Congrats. Why you want to torture us with Joe Buck, I know not.

    ***

    Lots of upside for Delmon.

    I strongly disagree. What do you foresee?

  16. Timothy P. Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:35 am

    Lots of bad attitudes from guys that are fans of east coasts teams, that's too bad.

  17. John Autin Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:35 am

    All I'm looking at is Delmon vs. Derek Holland: 6 for 14, 2 HRs....

    Roll out the barrel!

  18. Johnny Twisto Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:37 am

    Not sure whether I'd rather punch Joe Buck or the cast of Big Bang Theory. He seems like he'd fit in well with them.

  19. Johnny Twisto Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:38 am

    All I'm looking at is Delmon vs. Derek Holland: 6 for 14, 2 HRs....

    Ughh....

    Roll out the barrel!

    Timmy is putting cash on the Delmon barrel-chest. How much, TeePee?

  20. Timothy P. Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:41 am

    @15 I would say Jimmy Leland thinks Delmon has some upside, he's plugged him into the heart of his order and it's really helped the Tigers. I call him Jimmy because I feel like I know him.

  21. Dukeofflatbush Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:42 am

    I heard the Twins threw in Pucket’s toupee as part of the D-Young trade… any comments Timmy.

    Oh John (sometimes Timmy sidetracks me), I found that for guy’s over 200 IP this year, James Shields threw the fewest pitches per Inning; for guys who qualified, Josh Tomlin at just over 13.4. While Ryan Dempster had the highest at 17.34. Verlander averaged just about 15 per inning.

  22. Timothy P. Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:44 am

    @19 I don't get it, are you accusing me of being a homosexual again? I really don't get the reference to being barrel chested, but let me say again that I am not a homosexual, I've never been a homosexual, I don't partake in homosexual acts, nor do I own any homosexual accessories.

  23. Dukeofflatbush Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:45 am

    Joe Buck reminds me of the gay undertaker on SIX FEET UNDER.
    Tim McCarver reminds me of a washed up ballplayer whose career was extended because the best lefthander btwn Koufacs and Johnson wanted a kiss*ss caddy.

  24. Dukeofflatbush Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:46 am

    The last three statements bring to mind one word Timski - latent.

  25. John Autin Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:47 am

    I'm in fan mode, JT. Any small-sample enemy of my enemy is my friend!

  26. Timothy P. Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:49 am

    Duke you're a Yankee fan right?

  27. kds Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:49 am

    Delmon's brother was a better player and had a great nickname!

  28. Dukeofflatbush Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:51 am

    No Timmy, I am not, though, I must admit, I am dazzled by the pinstripes.

  29. Timothy P. Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:52 am

    Who is your team Duke?

  30. John Autin Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:54 am

    Hey, I went to a blog last night, and a junior-high locker room broke out!

  31. Dukeofflatbush Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:55 am

    JA and JT (and I guess TP),

    I don’t know if you gentlemen saw, but on an old thread I mentioned that Verlander’s season was so impressive; he became just the 10th pitcher in the live ball era to have a:
    ERA+ > 150
    WHIP 250
    SO > 250

    Any guesses on the other 9?

  32. Johnny Twisto Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:55 am

    TeePee:

    Duke is a Mutts fan!! But maybe not for long!!

    Barrel-chested: See post #10, or http://lmgtfy.com/?q=barrel+chested

    And your assumption of what Jimmy Cigs thinks is avoiding the question -- what do you think?

  33. Johnny Twisto Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:57 am

    I went to a blog last night, and a junior-high locker room broke out!

    It's been too long. All the towel snapping is what brings us together.

    (Timmy, would you consider a rolled up towel a (homosexual accessory"?)

  34. Dukeofflatbush Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:58 am

    In theory?
    I root for Pucket’s toupee.
    But in life I suffer through 162 games of blue and orange horror…

  35. Johnny Twisto Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:58 am

    Um, that bizarre extra parenthesis was supposed to be a quote mark.

  36. Dukeofflatbush Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 1:01 am

    Nah JA, Timmy strikes me as an underling or possibly a ‘look out’ for a weggie bully.

  37. Dukeofflatbush Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 1:02 am

    Sorry about 31.
    Its supposed to read:
    ERA+ > 150
    WHIP 250
    IP > 250

  38. Johnny Twisto Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 1:04 am

    Duke, I did see you post that on another thread. I still don't think you have it right though. WHIP 250?

  39. Johnny Twisto Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 1:05 am

    That one's probably supposed to be Ks

  40. Timothy P. Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 1:05 am

    I'm just a straight down the middle, good solid regular American. I like to say my prayers and take my vitamins and occasionally take out full-figured gals.

  41. Dukeofflatbush Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 1:13 am

    I think using the greater than and less than signs somehow gets mistaken for HTML, even when spread to multiple lines. I will now write it out long hand.
    ERA+ greater than 150
    SO greater than 250
    IP greater than 250
    WHIP less than 1

  42. Dukeofflatbush Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 1:16 am

    Timmy, would you call yourself - Tim McGreevy straight American or Rock Hudson straight.
    And JA, as far as your insulting insinuations that we are an immature bunch, I say - (I just passed wind)

  43. Dukeofflatbush Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 1:19 am

    Timmy,
    Would you please insult the Mets, its getting late.
    How do you like your new Chicago set-up.
    Theo in the north.
    Robin in the south.
    With horrible contracts abounding, like concrete shoes, no matter who you put in charge, your gonna sink.

  44. Johnny Twisto Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 1:19 am

    I'm sure I saw the answers before, but I don't really remember them, so how about

    Koufax
    Clemens
    Gooden
    Seaver
    Gibson
    S. McDowell
    Schilling
    R. Johnson
    Marichal

  45. Dukeofflatbush Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 1:27 am

    McClain
    Seaver x 2
    Blue
    Tiant
    Carlton
    Gibson
    Koufax x 3
    Gooden
    Verlander
    and I’ll leave off the last guy because he is the reason the question is so hard, almost impossible.
    (a hint) he all but admitted he cheated that year.

  46. Dukeofflatbush Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 1:50 am

    Sudden Sam missed the list in ’68 because of his walks, which pushed his WHIP up to 1.08, otherwise he was well above the other thresholds.
    The Unit missed it in 1999 by less than 10 baserunners. In 2001, he missed it by a third of an inning and one walk. In ’02 − 8 baserunners. Andin ’04, by 4 IP.
    The closest Clemen got was by 8 baserunners.
    Schilling is strange, his 4 highest SO seasons are very close, the low being 293 and the high being 319. Then his 5th highest total is 204, then never in the 200’s again.
    Marichal never SO 250, but he was also a victim of his era when it comes to ERA+ and I guess from pitching in such a big park (candle stick), but from ’63 to ’69 his high ERA was 2.76, no other was above 2.5, with an average of 2.34, yet only an ERA+ of 140.

  47. Evil Squirrel Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 2:24 am

    Here are the highest postseason pitch counts that are searchable on B-R. (Pitch counts are available for all games since 1988, and for some games as far back as 1970.)

    Except for 1999.... which has no pitch count data for the entire postseason it seems....

  48. Timothy P. Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 2:28 am

    @42 that was Jim McGreevy, not Tim and I've never set foot in New Jersey. My uncle told me about Rock Hudson being gay way back in the mid '70s before it was well known. My uncle would read The Enquirer every week and he said Rock was lovers with Jim Neighbors. That was a lot for a nine year old to digest back then.

  49. Timothy P. Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 2:30 am

    @43 I am worried about Theo coming to the Cubs, he has a history of throwing around money and that's what got us in the mess we're in now. In my heart I think Ventura will flame out as manager, just a hunch. I'm also a Rangers fan.

  50. Nash Bruce Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 5:41 am

    good god, where to begin....
    re: all of the Delmon Young comments........@7 JT: that's about 7 years too late for me!!!!!!!!!
    @16 TP: 'bad attitude' would be a polite way of summing up this Minnesota fan's feelings towards Delmon.
    @21 Duke: lol, "Puckett's toupee" would have more mobility in the outfield than Delmon Young, no matter whether Delmon was wearing the barrel, or......(wait for it Timmy.....wait for it!)......not.

    @43 Duke, 49 TP: Actually, from the little bit that I've read, the Cubs farm system is banging. (Oops, should have I rephrased that?!?) Maybe a couple of more years to start shedding bad contracts (I've also read that ownership is just about willing to eat the 65 mil or whatevs to dump Soriano, for example) and then Epstein is still there- I think that in 2-3 years they could be damned dangerous.
    But, I've only caught fragments.....if anyone else has a clearer viewpoint, pass it on?
    Also, slightly off topic-off topic(before the Doug Fister jokes begin anew), but has anyone heard of there being a possibility that Francona joins Epstein?

  51. Detroit Michael Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 9:08 am

    Even when Delmon Young is going well, he seldom walks because he swings at nearly everything and he plays defense poorly. His upside, a repeat of 2010, is pretty limited.

    Obviously, he's a good enough player to have a hot streak, but that doesn't make him elite compared to other major leaguers.

    Let's just enjoy the ride, Tiger fans, while it lasts!

  52. DaveZ Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 9:14 am

    re: McCarver...did anyone else catch what he said last night after the third strike passed ball/wild pitch...regarding 4 strikeouts in an inning...believe Buck said "It's been done NUMEROUS times in the past" to which McCarver chimes in "If anyone could do it, it would be Verlander". WTF?

    Just awful.

  53. Mike L Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 10:16 am

    @52, maybe we can calculate McCarver's WAR-A? He doth grow tiresome....

  54. John Autin Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 10:36 am

    @47, E.Sq. -- Yes, I see that you're right -- the postseason pitch counts are missing for all of 1999, plus a chunk of '97 and scattered other games. There are also several games in the '90s with obviously incomplete pitch counts.

    I don't know what the problem is. The regular-season pitch counts for 1999 seem to be 100% complete.

    I'll mention it to the powers-that-B-R.

  55. Verlander’s 133 pitches the most in a playoff game since Prior | courtneyallenbernard.com Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 11:58 am

    [...] season, also tied the mark set by Mark Prior of the Chicago Cubs in Game 3 of the 2003 NLDS for the most pitches thrown in a playoff game this century, according to [...]

  56. Jason Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:16 pm

    @48-Thanks for the laughs...

    Jim Nabors!!! Really!!! Never would have guessed.

    I always thought that Rock Hudson would have made
    a nice couple with Robert Reed, AKA Mr. Brady.

  57. Timothy P. Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 12:27 pm

    @56 Your going to have to talk with Twisto or Duke on that, they are the experts on everything gay, and gay culture in general. Both are really quite knowledgeable about that sort of thing.

  58. jason Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 1:02 pm

    DBE: 170+ pitches common

  59. jason Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 1:03 pm

    then again, 70 pitch CGs also common

  60. topper009 Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 1:35 pm

    I am starting to develop a theory on pitch counts that these rain delays got me thinking about. If a pitcher only throws 50 pitches but then has to sit for 2 hours for rain he can't go back in, so if the pitch count was really the controlling factor for pitching fatigue the rain delay shouldn't matter, but it does. Maybe what really matters is just the amount of the pitcher spends during an outing? This would explain why the older guys could throw 150 pitches on 3 days rest for the whole summer - the games went much faster back in the day.

    Does anyone really have a good explanation as to why the old timers needed less rest and routinely had higher pitch counts besides they were "tougher" or it was expected of them?

    Has anyone ever tried to correlate a decrease in pitching performance based on the time since the first pitch instead of the pitch count?

  61. Johnny Twisto Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 1:38 pm

    Jim Kaat said after two hours, his arm turned into a pumpkin.

  62. Jason Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 4:10 pm

    @57-
    I can't talk to them now. "Something suddenly came up".

  63. SocraticGadfly Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 4:42 pm

    Hey, Jack Morris' legendary 1991 appearance isn't on here ... and apparently nobody else noticed that yet.

  64. Timothy P. Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 8:12 pm

    @63 That's because Jack Morris is hated here at B-Ref, although he should not be.

  65. John Autin Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 8:15 pm

    @63, Socratic -- According to the retrosheet box score, Morris threw "only" 126 pitches in that 10-inning shutout, facing 38 batters, for an efficient average of 3.32 pitches apiece. He needed just 8 pitches in each of the last 2 innings.

    Besides an intentional walk, Morris had only four 3-ball counts, three of them with 2 outs, three with a man in scoring position and a base open; results were 1 walk and 3 outs.

    http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/MIN/MIN199110270.shtml

  66. John Autin Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 8:19 pm

    @63 -- Timbo, thy unjust barbs doth sting! There's a lot of room between not supporting the Morris HOF candidacy and hating the man.

    I wish my boys had Morris now!

  67. John Autin Says:
    October 14th, 2011 at 8:26 pm

    @60, Topper -- It's often said that before the age of buggy-whip bats and lineups with five 20-HR batters, a starting pitcher didn't have to bear down on every hitter.

    The lineup Verlander faced Thursday had 8 guys with at least 11 HRs and 5 with 25 or more. Not much chance to relax with a few get-'em-over fastballs.

  68. Biff Says:
    October 15th, 2011 at 5:53 am

    @40
    "I'm just a straight down the middle, good solid regular American. I like to say my prayers and take my vitamins and occasionally take out full-figured gals."

    So you're almost like Hulk Hogan then?

  69. Timothy P. Says:
    October 15th, 2011 at 7:52 pm

    I like Jack Morris for theHoF, it's been proven he was able to pitch to game conditions.

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