120+ Pitches & Less Than 5 Innings
Posted by Steve Lombardi on July 22, 2010
Since 1988, through July 21, 2010, how many starting pitchers have thrown 120+ pitches in a game while recording less than 15 outs in the contest? Thanks to Play Index, we can see the answer to that question.
| Rk | Player | Date | Tm | Opp | Rslt | App,Dec | IP | H | R | ER | BB | SO | HR | Pit | Str | GSc | IR | IS | BF | AB | 2B | 3B | IBB | HBP | SH | SF | GDP | SB | CS | PO | BK | WP | WPA | RE24 | ||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 1 | Victor Zambrano | 2004-05-20 | TBD | BOS | W 9-6 | GS-5 | 4.2 | 4 | 6 | 6 | 9 | 8 | 1 | 133 | 68 | 31 | 27 | 16 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 0 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 11.57 | 0.048 | -1.762 | 1.162 | ||
| 2 | Jose Rosado | 1999-07-17 | KCR | MIL | L 3-11 | GS-5 ,L | 4.2 | 12 | 9 | 9 | 3 | 4 | 3 | 122 | 76 | 5 | 29 | 23 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 2 | 17.36 | -0.330 | -6.369 | .801 | ||
| 3 | Darren Oliver | 1999-06-19 | STL | NYM | W 7-6 | GS-4 | 4.0 | 7 | 6 | 6 | 5 | 5 | 2 | 121 | 63 | 24 | 24 | 19 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 13.50 | -0.145 | -2.776 | .980 | ||
| 4 | Wilson Alvarez | 1999-05-28 | TBD | SEA | L 1-6 | GS-5 ,L | 4.2 | 7 | 4 | 4 | 6 | 3 | 2 | 131 | 77 | 31 | 27 | 21 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 7.71 | -0.154 | -1.550 | .860 | ||
| 5 | Dwight Gooden | 1998-08-29 | CLE | OAK | L 6-11 | GS-5 | 4.2 | 8 | 4 | 4 | 5 | 5 | 0 | 127 | 70 | 32 | 27 | 21 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 0 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 7.71 | -0.204 | -1.444 | 1.542 | ||
| 6 | Dwight Gooden | 1996-09-03 | NYY | OAK | L 9-10 | GS-5 | 4.2 | 8 | 6 | 5 | 3 | 4 | 1 | 132 | 75 | 27 | 25 | 21 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 9.64 | -0.327 | -3.327 | 1.175 | ||
| 7 | Mark Gardner | 1996-08-18 | SFG | PHI | L 6-7 | GS-5 ,L | 4.2 | 11 | 7 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 0 | 122 | 81 | 25 | 30 | 27 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 3.86 | -0.527 | -4.715 | 1.507 | ||
| 8 | Paul Wilson | 1996-05-25 | NYM | SDP | L 2-7 | GS-5 ,L | 4.2 | 7 | 7 | 3 | 5 | 4 | 0 | 121 | 64 | 29 | 27 | 21 | 2 | 1 | 2 | 0 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 5.79 | -0.444 | -4.838 | 1.424 | ||
| 9 | Joe Magrane | 1994-05-15 | CAL | SEA | L 5-9 | GS-5 ,L | 4.1 | 8 | 5 | 5 | 5 | 2 | 2 | 124 | 61 | 24 | 25 | 20 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 10.38 | -0.335 | -2.617 | 1.267 | ||
| 10 | Cal Eldred | 1993-07-02 | MIL | MIN | L 10-11 | GS-5 | 4.2 | 8 | 5 | 5 | 6 | 5 | 2 | 122 | 68 | 27 | 28 | 21 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 4 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 9.64 | -0.362 | -3.152 | 1.121 | ||
| 11 | Bobby Witt | 1992-08-15 | TEX | DET | L 3-10 | GS-5 ,L | 4.2 | 5 | 6 | 6 | 10 | 2 | 0 | 122 | 59 | 22 | 29 | 17 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 11.57 | -0.275 | -2.409 | 1.452 | ||
| 12 | Pat Combs | 1991-06-16 | PHI | CIN | L 6-8 | GS-5 | 4.1 | 4 | 4 | 4 | 7 | 7 | 1 | 120 | 70 | 39 | 23 | 16 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 8.31 | -0.195 | -1.973 | 1.405 |
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So, it's 12 times in total and none in the last six years.
The one here that jumps out the most to me? Jose Rosado. At first, I wondered if that was the game that fried his career. But, he did pitch well over the rest of that season. In any event, I wonder if we'll ever see a starting pitcher do this again...since it's been a while since we last saw it?
July 22nd, 2010 at 10:42 pm
That 2004 game is also notable for its bizarre top of the first inning: three walks, and three strikeouts looking. Effectively, no one took the bat off his shoulder.
July 22nd, 2010 at 10:48 pm
I am shocked Kerry Wood is not on this list
July 23rd, 2010 at 1:43 am
I am shocked Daisuke Matsuzaka is not on this list -- more than once.
July 23rd, 2010 at 8:47 am
Amazing that two guys on this list threw no hitters (Gooden and Alvarez). And if I remember right, Witt almost threw a perfecto against the A's.
July 23rd, 2010 at 10:00 am
Most of the pitchers listed did fry their arms. It wasn't this one game, but a pattern of pitching under stress where you are in trouble and you think you need something 'extra' on the ball.
Also, in that era, it was the dawning of the time where anyone in the lineup could go deep at any time. I just finished a book that recapped the 70's. Luis Tiant threw 155 pitches in one of the WS games of 1975. Yes, he was Tiant, and it was the WS. I think his motion took stress off of his arm, and he always changed speeds. But also only four Reds had double digits in home runs. He didn't have to 'bear down' as much.
July 23rd, 2010 at 10:01 am
I wonder what lists like these would look like based on batters faced. For example, fewest batters faced in a game where a pitcher threw 100+ pitches? Stuff like that.
July 23rd, 2010 at 10:27 am
Turns out it's 19, done 8 times. The most pitches thrown in that type of game is 104, done twice. On the lookout, then, for a pitcher to face 18 batters and throw 100+ pitches. If you go to 110, the "record" is unique to one player: just last year, the Nationals' Shairon Martis needed 110 pitches to make it through 20 batters (and he actually pitched OK, ie not awful, 5 IP, 1 R, 3 H, 4 BB, 1 K).
July 23rd, 2010 at 10:29 am
It doesn't surprise me at all to see good pitchers on this list. Like career bad stats: most walks given up, most errors, most losses as a pitcher, you don't get the opportunity to collect that many mistakes unless you are doing something else right. Similarly, guys who are stinking up the joint are much more likely to get left in for 120 pitches if they are generally very good, than if they are average.
July 23rd, 2010 at 11:29 am
If we had pitch counts going back to '86 and '87, I bet we'd see Bobby Witt's name on there a few more times. Witt walked batters at an almost unfathomably high rate, to go along with his high strikeout rate:
'86: 8.2 BB/9, 9.9 K/9
'87: 8.8 BB/9, 10.1 K/9
He lasted fewer than six innings in 31 of his 56 starts over those two years; in 16 of those starts, he lasted fewer than five. He averaged only 5.1 innings per start in '86, and 5.7 in '87. He posted WHIPs over 1.7 both years, and a cumulative ERA of 5.21--and yet he managed a .500 record (19-19)!
By '92, which is when he appears on the above list, his K rate was down to 5.8, his BB rate was down to "only" 5.3, and he was averaging over six innings per start.
July 23rd, 2010 at 3:19 pm
Silly question time:
If a pitcher uses his arm to throw over to first (for pick-off attempts) why aren't throw-overs counted in the pitch total?
Even if the distance is different, he still wastes a throw which takes a toll on his arm...
July 23rd, 2010 at 3:21 pm
This doesn't take into count the pitchers that need 120+ pitches to get thu five (but then went on to complete 5 or more innings). I would bet that list would be simialr to the one above (mostly 1990's - Al Lieter? - with not too many recent ones - maybe Sabathia?).
July 23rd, 2010 at 3:50 pm
I poked a bit through Witt's gamelogs. Check out this game he started against the Red Sox in 1987:
http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/TEX/TEX198704240.shtml
3.1 IP (23 BF)
4 H
3 R (3 ER)
9 BB
6 K
Nine walks and six strikeouts in 3 1/3! The absolute minimum number of pitches he could have thrown is 62 (8 from balls in play, 36 from walks, 18 from strikeouts). If he averaged, say, six pitches per walk, five per strikeout, and three per ball in play, that would give him 108. He probably didn't reach 120 (though it's not implausible), but he must have cleared 100 easily. In just 3 1/3 innings!
It's pretty remarkable, actually, that he only gave up three runs despite allowing 13/23 batters to reach.
July 23rd, 2010 at 8:14 pm
@4 I was about to post that Witt did pitch a perfect game in his career until I remembered that there were two pitchers named Witt who debuted in the 1980s. I thought right away of Mike Witt, who had the perfect game, while the one in this list was Bobby.